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Dvd's perish over time
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cyberrich
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 17, 2013 1:32 pm    Post subject: Dvd's perish over time Reply with quote

I was wondering how long my Avengers box sets of dvd's will last? I ask because tonight I tried to watch Octopussy which is in my Roger Moore Ultimate edition box set of Bond films and it kept sticking and eventually wouldn't play. I bought this box set about a year ago along with the Sean Connery Ultimate edition box set. I'm gradually working my way through the films, and this was the first time I'd ever played the Octopussy disc. When I checked the disc I noticed the surface was sticky. All the other Roger Moore discs when I checked have now started to go sticky on the playing side. The Live and let die disc looks awful now, yet it was fine when I played it a few months ago. I have many box sets on the shelf surrounding the Bond ones. I've checked and the other box sets look fine. So far Exclamation I'd hate The Avengers box sets to go the same way. It's a mystery why the Moore box set has started to biodegrade. Is that the right term Question Can anyone help Question Thanks, Rich.
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anti-clockwise
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 17, 2013 3:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It sounds to me like you got a bad product with the Bond DVD's. I copied below a description of how DVD's are made from a website. They are made of multiple layers of plastic. I imagine if it is not cured under infrared light long enough or any of the steps below are not done correctly in the manufacturing process, they could degrade into sticky plastic. This is just a guess Rich. But if your other DVD's are still good it just doesn't add up. So sorry you had that happen! I would say return them but I know you said they are a year old.
Below is the description of how DVD's are made.


DVDs are of the same diameter and thickness as CDs, and they are made using some of the same materials and manufacturing methods. Like a CD, the data on a DVD is encoded in the form of small pits and bumps in the track of the disc.

A DVD is composed of several layers of plastic, totaling about 1.2 millimeters thick. Each layer is created by injection molding polycarbonate plastic. This process forms a disc that has microscopic bumps arranged as a single, continuous and extremely long spiral track of data.

Once the clear pieces of polycarbonate are formed, a thin reflective layer is sputtered onto the disc, covering the bumps. Aluminum is used behind the inner layers, but a semi-reflective gold layer is used for the outer layers, allowing the laser to focus through the outer and onto the inner layers. After all of the layers are made, each one is coated with lacquer, squeezed together and cured under infrared light.
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Last edited by anti-clockwise on Sun Aug 18, 2013 10:32 am; edited 1 time in total
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dissolute
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 17, 2013 3:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Have you been keeping them in their original cases or in plastic sleeves? I know those DVD binder things can end up sticking to the disc and they're hard to clean because you don't want to melt the plastic with acetate.

You might want to try one of those DVD scratch remover products, and just use the hardening fluid. (they usually have two wipes, one to soften the disc surface to soften the scratch so it smooths out, the other to reharden the plastic surface).

All guesswork, of course, no warranty is implied or given and I am not liable for any damage done etc...
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cyberrich
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2013 3:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the replies. I also have the Connery box set bought at the same time (Just checked and it's Nov 2010, so longer ago than I thought!) and that still looks fine, it's only the Moore discs that have gone sticky. I've just read on one forum that there has been issues with MGM discs in the past whereby some glue-like substance within the discs starts to seep out over time onto the surface of the disc making them sticky and then they won't play properly. I believe you can wash them with soapy water which someone said makes the discs play again. I think I'd rather return them to MGM for corrected discs. Hopefully the Avengers dvd's won't start to be affected like this Exclamation
Can I ask 2 questions Question Am I safe to play my other dvd's in my player after trying to play the Bond disc which kept freezing last night. It won't affect the playing surfaces of other discs now placed in the player will it? Also, I can't find a UK email address for MGM. Can anyone help? Many thanks, Richard. Sad
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anti-clockwise
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2013 10:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I doubt the DVD player would be affected but I am not sure. If it is MGM I imagine it is a US address? But more importantly after 3 years I am skeptical they would do a return even though clearly there is probably a defect in the manufacturing process. I would contact the US address for MGM if I were to try. Is there any address on the box set?
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mousemeat
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 19, 2013 6:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

anti-clockwise wrote:
I doubt the DVD player would be affected but I am not sure. If it is MGM I imagine it is a US address? But more importantly after 3 years I am skeptical they would do a return even though clearly there is probably a defect in the manufacturing process. I would contact the US address for MGM if I were to try. Is there any address on the box set?


MGM has changed owners several times..so exchanging mine be a problem..unless they are selling disks with a life exchange...I believe it's conditions that cause the discs to begin the break down and sticky process..CD's also have suffered from a similar fate..and have dealt with something called CD ROT. I wonder if blu-ray disks will suffer this fate as well ?
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Macfly77
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 19, 2013 6:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree that you should contact the DVD publisher, but make sure it's actually MGM.
In the UK and over the years, Bond DVD's have been released by MGM, Sony and 20th Century Fox.
Additionally, if you find an address/e-mail/telephone number for the customer service of their UK branch, that's probably where you should start (I wouldn't bother trying to contact the US branch as they would have very little to do with their UK counterpart).
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cyberrich
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 19, 2013 8:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

[quote="mousemeat"]
anti-clockwise wrote:

.I believe it's conditions that cause the discs to begin the break down and sticky process..CD's also have suffered from a similar fate..and have dealt with something called CD ROT. I wonder if blu-ray disks will suffer this fate as well ?


Does anyone know what conditions cause this break down of the disc? I only keep the box sets on the shelf away from heat and damp, etc and all the other box sets look fine.
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anti-clockwise
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 19, 2013 8:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I wouldn't worry too much. I think the Bond DVD's were due to a manufacturing defect--not to any sort of breakdown.

But in general keep away from sunlight especially as ultraviolet light can degrade discs.
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cyberrich
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 19, 2013 9:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

There's 2 email addresses on the Bond box set. MGM appears to be the US one, the other is 20th century fox which is a UK email address. I've emailed them. I'm hoping they have an exchange policy Exclamation I know I've had the box set over 2 years, but as it's a manufacturing issue I hope they do the honourable thing. I've heard about disc rot and other such things, but I thought it was all just scaremongering. I can't believe what's happened to my Bond set after only 2 years, especially as I look after everything so well. What is going to happen to all our dvd's in time Question I still have my old Avengers videos in a cupboard. I think I'll keep them just in case Exclamation Rich.
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anti-clockwise
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 19, 2013 9:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I know the feeling. One of your most treasured possessions no doubt! That is pretty freaky. I can only imagine those poor discs turning to glue. Ugh! Well please do let us know how it goes. I hope they do the honourable thing as well. Good luck.
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cyberrich
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 21, 2013 7:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have been able to remove the sticky glue from the discs with a cloth dipped in soapy water and now the discs play again. It's 3 films that have been affected so far, the other 4 look ok, touch wood. The Connery box set also is ok. Can I ask any knowledgeable people out there, will the movies stored on those 3 discs start to diminish over time, now this substance has oozed out of the disc. Was this glue used to keep the data safe on the disc? Or will it make no difference? Hope it's the latter! I'm still waiting to hear back from MGM. Thanks, Rich.
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anti-clockwise
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 21, 2013 8:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

cyberrich wrote:
I have been able to remove the sticky glue from the discs with a cloth dipped in soapy water and now the discs play again. It's 3 films that have been affected so far, the other 4 look ok, touch wood. The Connery box set also is ok. Can I ask any knowledgeable people out there, will the movies stored on those 3 discs start to diminish over time, now this substance has oozed out of the disc. Was this glue used to keep the data safe on the disc? Or will it make no difference? Hope it's the latter! I'm still waiting to hear back from MGM. Thanks, Rich.
Sorry I have no clue. But obviously if they work you didn't need all that glue after all. Rolling Eyes
That is so weird Rich. So weird.
the nice thing about the Bond DVD's is there will always be a market for them so if they ever are problematic not sure how much you spent on them but at least they are replaceable.
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Frankymole
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 21, 2013 9:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Losing the bonding between layers of a disk is unlikely to affect the playback, as long as the laser-reader in your player can "see" straight through to the pits in the metallic "foil" that is where the holographic image is (the optically stored data). Having the blobs of leaked glue would have interfered with the ability of it to be read by the laser.

However, damaged disks (ones with cracks, or dents or bends) have been known to shatter at high speed and damage the drive by suddenly jamming it.

I don't know if a disk with "loose" or unstuck layers can do this. It's the only possibility I can think of why they wouldn't work as well without the "glue".
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mousemeat
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 21, 2013 11:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Frankymole wrote:
Losing the bonding between layers of a disk is unlikely to affect the playback, as long as the laser-reader in your player can "see" straight through to the pits in the metallic "foil" that is where the holographic image is (the optically stored data). Having the blobs of leaked glue would have interfered with the ability of it to be read by the laser.

However, damaged disks (ones with cracks, or dents or bends) have been known to shatter at high speed and damage the drive by suddenly jamming it.

I don't know if a disk with "loose" or unstuck layers can do this. It's the only possibility I can think of why they wouldn't work as well without the "glue".


I've read of similar issues..but haven't had it happen ..could be a fluke thing..then again. maybe it's the curse of new hi tech...
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cyberrich
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 22, 2013 1:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

After what happened to my Bond dvd's, I've been reading up on disc longevity on the net. I did know that manufactured cd's and dvd's should last roughly 100 years. So our Avengers discs should last us our lifetime Exclamation Though no one knows anything for sure yet. What did surprise me was that burned cd's and dvd's do not last that long. No-one seems to know how long, but I've read as little as 2-5 years, though on one forum people were disputing this by saying it's more like 10+ years. A good make of disc lasts longer. Mine are maxell. I think these are an ok brand. I've checked a few of mine. All are ok so far, including the oldest one which is about 10 years old. Does anyone know anything concrete Question I'm surprised our own homemade discs won't stay the course. It seems like my next job will be backing up the things I really want the most on a USB stick. Hopefully one day with all this advancing technology someone will invent something that will last. Or maybe the industry doesn't want us to own anything for too long. My pockets are only so deep Exclamation Rich, in name only.
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anti-clockwise
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 22, 2013 2:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

wow that's interesting about burned discs not lasting long. I have to say I think that discs i have burned are working well after a few years. But i have not checked all of them. To be honest if they are that unreliable tapes are better. I have very old tapes that still work. That's lame about burned discs though. Do you know why?
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dissolute
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 22, 2013 3:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I always back up my DVD & BRD to digital copies, but you need a ton of disk space to do it - worth it though, as you can make backups locally, on different disks, in the cloud... Burnt CDs & DVDs do die, I have some from 2002 that no longer work. Tape gets mould on it easily, unless you store them air tight in a dry environment. Even film decays.
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Frankymole
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 22, 2013 4:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, I back up my burnt disks to hard drives - but even hard drives fail, so you need backups of the backups...

Daylight / sunlight is bad for home-burnt disks. Something to do with the dye they use.

Maxell and Verbatim are good makes, but a lot depends on the sub-contracting factory they use. Sometimes a good brand can get a duff batch from a bad factory when they change manufacturers.
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cyberrich
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 23, 2013 7:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Even USB sticks have a lifespan. About 10 years I've just read on one forum, so even that isn't permanent. Magnetic tape seems to be the most enduring, but I don't know anything about that yet. I wonder what the safest and most enduring method of keeping data is Question I know quite a few people who are copying everything from their old vidoes onto disc, and yet from what I've been reading video is more permanent.
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